Its hard to believe it was 12 years ago that I first met Shannyn Sossamon. We were basically both starting our careers at the same time. I had been a journalist for a year and a half and one of the first big studio movie press junkets I covered was for A Knights Tale. It was Sossamons debut movie.
Now both of us are veterans in our respective industries. Just look at our archives to see all the actor and filmmakers I have interviewed over the years. Sossamon has been in films like The Holiday, The Day and Kiss Kiss Bang Bang and television series like Dirt, Moonlight and How to Make It In America.
Her latest film is the very personal film of Mark Webber, The End of Love. Webber wrote, directed and stars as himself, a struggling actor raising his real life son Isaac. Webbers acting friends Michael Cera, Jason Ritter and Aubrey Plaza play themselves in the film. Sossamon plays Lydia, a single mother with whom Mark connects, while he struggles to land auditions, pay his rent, and take care of Isaac. In the film, Mark is widowed from Isaacs mother, but in real life Isaacs mother is still alive, just separated from Webber.
The End of Love premiered at the Sundance Film Festival in 2012. It played on VOD in February and opened in theaters March 1. We got a chance to speak with Sossamon by phone about being a part of someones labor of love, and get her thoughts on the rapidly evolving film industry.
Suicide Girls: You play one of the non-actor characters in The End of Love, but can you relate to Marcs world of struggling actors and their actor friends?
Shannyn Sossamon: Oh, absolutely. Very much so. The pain of auditioning and how torturous that can be. Being a single parent, seeing other people rise to success and feeling frustration and envy that you havent gotten their yourself. Absolutely. I was really impressed and proud of him that he showed that side.
SG: Do you also know Michael Cera, Jason Ritter and Aubrey Plaza socially?
SS: No, not at all. I tend to be, unfortunately or fortunately, Im not quite sure yet, but a little bit more of a loner. I was just speaking with another journalist about that, talking about the actors community and how important that is. I do think its important. I think theres a happy medium. I dont want to be talking about the industry all the time at all, but I dont think being a loner, isolating yourself from everyone is so healthy either. So theres a medium. No, to be honest, Ive never met any of them.
SG: That makes sense too, because that was his group of friends.
SS: Well, it makes sense in the movie but it wouldnt be that odd if I had met them in real life.
SG: No, it wouldnt. Have you ever been part of a film this personal before?
SS: No.
SG: Have you been part of other personal films that now seem less intensely personal compared to The End of Love?
SS: Yeah, there was a film I did with Monte Hellman thats very personal to him for sure, but maybe not this much.
SG: What was it like to be a part of scenes with Mark and his son, knowing they were real?
SS: It was great. Kids are beautiful to be in scenes with because even kids that young, as young as Isaac was in the movie, because they are so truthful, and they dont care about a camera. They dont care about Hollywood. They just need to survive and get what they need at any moment. Its great.
SG: I understand in real life the boys mother is still alive. Did you ever meet her?
SS: Yeah, I actually met her randomly right after Id agreed to do the film with Mark. I went to a grocery store in West Hollywood and she was there. She came up to me and she said, Hi, Im Frankie. Youre doing Marcs film. She was very, very sweet and just a joy. But Mark and I both thought that was interesting that that happened.
SG: Since this was a labor of love, was he working around your schedule?
SS: Yeah, a little bit but not anything ridiculous. If I couldnt make it one day, I had an important meeting or audition, something that was really important then I could come in later. It was really working around Isaac so that atmosphere was there from the beginning, a little bit more of a lackadaisical kind of rhythm.
SG: Could you see yourself making a love letter to your own kids?
SS: Yes. Maybe in a different way, but absolutely for sure.
SG: So maybe not a film?
SS: Yeah, but something.
SG: Do you have ambitions to write and direct?
SS: Yeah, always have. Ive been working on something for a couple years now, just writing it, but I never was naturally a screenwriter so its something you have to really learn and theres lots of trial and error. Im deep in that process whenever I have time. I just had my second child almost a year ago so its been a little intense around the house.
SG: How long have you been working on the script?
SS: Its been in my head for two or three years.
SG: Its hard to believe its been 12 years since A Knights Tale. How do you look back on your debut?
SS: Ooh, I havent seen it in so long. Ive only seen it once or twice in the first place and I just havent seen it in so long. You just wish you could do it again. I look back on it fondly for sure but youre always like, Oh, if I could have that role now which is pretty normal I think in life. You always see your mistakes and Im very hard on myself.
SG: Are you hard on yourself in The End of Love also?
SS: That ones different actually because its all improv so you have no idea whats going to end up on screen, so your characters journey and focus and meaning could be altered depending on what they use for each take. We did such wildly different things in each take. Thats actually the scary thing about an improv film but I trusted Mark so much so I knew my every whim and everything that came out of my mouth in those moments in his hands. But yeah, you still look at something and you always know that you could have done better or have been braver. I think Ill always be like that though. Arent most people like that.
SG: Yes, I think so.
SS: Yeah, I mean, who really looks at something and goes, Ah, its perfect? Maybe for a moment. You need to walk away. Theres a healthy amount of you cant torture yourself, but thats whats interesting is that quest I think.
SG: How do you look back at the beginning period of your career around A Knights Tale when you were just getting into the business?
SS: Oh, I look back at it not as fondly as I would like. Sometimes Im very frustrated with it and then other times Im very grateful for it because it brought me to where I am now which is just to even have opportunities to continue working. But what I would say about that period was that I had no idea what I was getting into. I now have a great respect for the business. I think success comes from when people have really wanted something. First of all, you have to have the desire. You have to want something for a very long time and work for it. Then youre ready for the success that comes with it, so to be in a big feature film when I hadnt even really studied, my mind just wasnt ready. So I look back on that period as a too soon kind of thing, but then like I said, I am also very grateful for it as well. I mean, I was so lost. I didnt quite know what the heck was going on but I will say this. I miss a little bit of what I had back then which was something just completely operating on my instincts alone, and I think that thats wonderful for actors to be in that state.
SG: When did it click for you that you reached a point where you were operating more on experience than instinct?
SS: Just recently. I think probably just the last year to be really honest. I did something that is dangerous to do if you really want to be good at one thing, or to be good at what you want to do. I was very wishy washy. I was one foot in, one foot out. I was dabbling in music, I was with my kids, there was never any focus or discipline. That is really necessary if you want to do quality work. So it was that. That was all that was missing. The desire and the talent and the tools were there. Thats what I noticed. Im really enjoying being an actor.
SG: The story is that you were discovered while DJing. How long did you still DJ?
SS: That is the story but the truth is that I was just playing records at that time because I wasnt social. I was never good at small talk and I still am not. So I wanted to be out and I loved watching people. I loved music, I loved dancing and I loved drinking so I wanted to control the atmosphere with the music. Everything was great about being a DJ. Everything that I liked and wanted to do was perfect but I didnt have the passion to be a really great mixmaster DJ. It wasnt a technical skill that I cared about. I could have easily just made a CD of all the songs I wanted to play and put it in and pretended to press play as each one ended. It wasnt the skill of being a DJ. It was just kind of what it allowed me to do. So yeah, to answer your question, I was never really a DJ at all.
SG: And you dont still play music that way?
SS: No, not really. Once in a while I will but it will just be off my iPod or laptop. I sold my turntables to a good friend a while back. I did that Gap commercial that seemed like I was really a professional DJ but I was just really dancing the whole time. It was just a little hobby.
SG: Whether you were fully invested or not, you worked pretty steadily for 10 years. Were you able to pay your rent from acting?
SS: Yeah, I have been able to do that.
SG: What got your through the rough or lean times?
SS: Oh, unemployment. Family, friends. There have been some incredibly lean times. This last pregnancy was really hard. I didnt work for two years and I couldnt afford to not work for two years but I knew I was supposed to have another child and when it happens, it happens. Just faith and hope. Its such a cliche I feel like at this point, but there have been many times where I thought I should just quit. So when I hear the actors that I admire and love, like Marion Cotillard and Amy Adams and Naomi Watts and Marisa Tomei, these women whose integrity and personal drive I admire and also actresses that have success in later years, thats the only option for me now. Im 34. You just have to have some kind of faith, but what I was going to say is its nice to hear from all of them that there were these periods where they felt like quitting and I understand what that feels like. Now I understand what that feels like.
SG: Now that youre back, does it feel like a whole different world for actors?
SS: It does. It is strange. What do you make of it?
SG: I think there are so many new opportunities for movies to be on VOD or download, and theres more TV shows like you were on series for FX and HBO which is a new thing in the last 10 years. There are so many more avenues, but I wonder does that mean there are more opportunities or its more competitive?
SS: Oh, good, good, good, good question/thoughts. I love analyzing this stuff. I love studying the business very much, even from my house. Its fascinating to me. I think a couple things. I think it does make it more competitive, but I do feel that actors do themselves a disservice to be too competitive, and Ive felt this for a while. Ive noticed in just observing that theres this intensely intense competitive quality that actors possess for survival reasons alone that is admirable in one way because its like wow, you really have access to this hunger, but I believe that the energy is channeled into the wrong department and it rips them of the magic, the childlike magic that is required for truly great work. Their bodies are hardbodies, theyre charming as shit at every moment. Its so disturbing almost to watch. So I dont know if that competitiveness is really a danger for actors, and this will lead me to my next thing which is that Ive also noticed were in a time right now where the cream will rise to the top and that should give actors who are meant to be sharing and telling stories, its very lucky for them. As you said, there are so many avenues and ways to be seen that if youre doing it from the right place and youre doing truly good intentioned quality work, youre going to be okay because it will rise to the top and you couldnt go by unnoticed where you might have years ago.
SG: I agree with that. If youre good it spreads. Even people being discovered on YouTube.
SS: Yeah, I was going to say especially that. I think a lot of comedians are realizing that that might be their ticket. They dont have to wait to get on SNL. They can actually make their own skits and put them online. Thats the blessing of the time right now, that if youre good, then show us what youve got because everyones watching.
SG: You have a role coming up on Mistresses. How is that the next step for you?
SS: That was an interesting step. My manager really pushed me into that and Im grateful that he did because it was a good move. I had just had my second son. Id gained a lot of weight. I was in a very soft, nursing, couch kind of place. It was about four months after Id had him and he said, Its just seven episodes, in and out. You dont have to sign a six year contract. Its a soft role so it really matched with my state of being at that time, really soft. Shes a kind of passive half of a lesbian relationship. I really loved the costar I was working with, the person I had to be in a relationship with, Jes Macallan. Shes a wonderful actress and I just had a lot of fun, and it financially supported me because I hadnt worked for a year and a half, so there were more reasons than just the financial.
Now both of us are veterans in our respective industries. Just look at our archives to see all the actor and filmmakers I have interviewed over the years. Sossamon has been in films like The Holiday, The Day and Kiss Kiss Bang Bang and television series like Dirt, Moonlight and How to Make It In America.
Her latest film is the very personal film of Mark Webber, The End of Love. Webber wrote, directed and stars as himself, a struggling actor raising his real life son Isaac. Webbers acting friends Michael Cera, Jason Ritter and Aubrey Plaza play themselves in the film. Sossamon plays Lydia, a single mother with whom Mark connects, while he struggles to land auditions, pay his rent, and take care of Isaac. In the film, Mark is widowed from Isaacs mother, but in real life Isaacs mother is still alive, just separated from Webber.
The End of Love premiered at the Sundance Film Festival in 2012. It played on VOD in February and opened in theaters March 1. We got a chance to speak with Sossamon by phone about being a part of someones labor of love, and get her thoughts on the rapidly evolving film industry.
Suicide Girls: You play one of the non-actor characters in The End of Love, but can you relate to Marcs world of struggling actors and their actor friends?
Shannyn Sossamon: Oh, absolutely. Very much so. The pain of auditioning and how torturous that can be. Being a single parent, seeing other people rise to success and feeling frustration and envy that you havent gotten their yourself. Absolutely. I was really impressed and proud of him that he showed that side.
SG: Do you also know Michael Cera, Jason Ritter and Aubrey Plaza socially?
SS: No, not at all. I tend to be, unfortunately or fortunately, Im not quite sure yet, but a little bit more of a loner. I was just speaking with another journalist about that, talking about the actors community and how important that is. I do think its important. I think theres a happy medium. I dont want to be talking about the industry all the time at all, but I dont think being a loner, isolating yourself from everyone is so healthy either. So theres a medium. No, to be honest, Ive never met any of them.
SG: That makes sense too, because that was his group of friends.
SS: Well, it makes sense in the movie but it wouldnt be that odd if I had met them in real life.
SG: No, it wouldnt. Have you ever been part of a film this personal before?
SS: No.
SG: Have you been part of other personal films that now seem less intensely personal compared to The End of Love?
SS: Yeah, there was a film I did with Monte Hellman thats very personal to him for sure, but maybe not this much.
SG: What was it like to be a part of scenes with Mark and his son, knowing they were real?
SS: It was great. Kids are beautiful to be in scenes with because even kids that young, as young as Isaac was in the movie, because they are so truthful, and they dont care about a camera. They dont care about Hollywood. They just need to survive and get what they need at any moment. Its great.
SG: I understand in real life the boys mother is still alive. Did you ever meet her?
SS: Yeah, I actually met her randomly right after Id agreed to do the film with Mark. I went to a grocery store in West Hollywood and she was there. She came up to me and she said, Hi, Im Frankie. Youre doing Marcs film. She was very, very sweet and just a joy. But Mark and I both thought that was interesting that that happened.
SG: Since this was a labor of love, was he working around your schedule?
SS: Yeah, a little bit but not anything ridiculous. If I couldnt make it one day, I had an important meeting or audition, something that was really important then I could come in later. It was really working around Isaac so that atmosphere was there from the beginning, a little bit more of a lackadaisical kind of rhythm.
SG: Could you see yourself making a love letter to your own kids?
SS: Yes. Maybe in a different way, but absolutely for sure.
SG: So maybe not a film?
SS: Yeah, but something.
SG: Do you have ambitions to write and direct?
SS: Yeah, always have. Ive been working on something for a couple years now, just writing it, but I never was naturally a screenwriter so its something you have to really learn and theres lots of trial and error. Im deep in that process whenever I have time. I just had my second child almost a year ago so its been a little intense around the house.
SG: How long have you been working on the script?
SS: Its been in my head for two or three years.
SG: Its hard to believe its been 12 years since A Knights Tale. How do you look back on your debut?
SS: Ooh, I havent seen it in so long. Ive only seen it once or twice in the first place and I just havent seen it in so long. You just wish you could do it again. I look back on it fondly for sure but youre always like, Oh, if I could have that role now which is pretty normal I think in life. You always see your mistakes and Im very hard on myself.
SG: Are you hard on yourself in The End of Love also?
SS: That ones different actually because its all improv so you have no idea whats going to end up on screen, so your characters journey and focus and meaning could be altered depending on what they use for each take. We did such wildly different things in each take. Thats actually the scary thing about an improv film but I trusted Mark so much so I knew my every whim and everything that came out of my mouth in those moments in his hands. But yeah, you still look at something and you always know that you could have done better or have been braver. I think Ill always be like that though. Arent most people like that.
SG: Yes, I think so.
SS: Yeah, I mean, who really looks at something and goes, Ah, its perfect? Maybe for a moment. You need to walk away. Theres a healthy amount of you cant torture yourself, but thats whats interesting is that quest I think.
SG: How do you look back at the beginning period of your career around A Knights Tale when you were just getting into the business?
SS: Oh, I look back at it not as fondly as I would like. Sometimes Im very frustrated with it and then other times Im very grateful for it because it brought me to where I am now which is just to even have opportunities to continue working. But what I would say about that period was that I had no idea what I was getting into. I now have a great respect for the business. I think success comes from when people have really wanted something. First of all, you have to have the desire. You have to want something for a very long time and work for it. Then youre ready for the success that comes with it, so to be in a big feature film when I hadnt even really studied, my mind just wasnt ready. So I look back on that period as a too soon kind of thing, but then like I said, I am also very grateful for it as well. I mean, I was so lost. I didnt quite know what the heck was going on but I will say this. I miss a little bit of what I had back then which was something just completely operating on my instincts alone, and I think that thats wonderful for actors to be in that state.
SG: When did it click for you that you reached a point where you were operating more on experience than instinct?
SS: Just recently. I think probably just the last year to be really honest. I did something that is dangerous to do if you really want to be good at one thing, or to be good at what you want to do. I was very wishy washy. I was one foot in, one foot out. I was dabbling in music, I was with my kids, there was never any focus or discipline. That is really necessary if you want to do quality work. So it was that. That was all that was missing. The desire and the talent and the tools were there. Thats what I noticed. Im really enjoying being an actor.
SG: The story is that you were discovered while DJing. How long did you still DJ?
SS: That is the story but the truth is that I was just playing records at that time because I wasnt social. I was never good at small talk and I still am not. So I wanted to be out and I loved watching people. I loved music, I loved dancing and I loved drinking so I wanted to control the atmosphere with the music. Everything was great about being a DJ. Everything that I liked and wanted to do was perfect but I didnt have the passion to be a really great mixmaster DJ. It wasnt a technical skill that I cared about. I could have easily just made a CD of all the songs I wanted to play and put it in and pretended to press play as each one ended. It wasnt the skill of being a DJ. It was just kind of what it allowed me to do. So yeah, to answer your question, I was never really a DJ at all.
SG: And you dont still play music that way?
SS: No, not really. Once in a while I will but it will just be off my iPod or laptop. I sold my turntables to a good friend a while back. I did that Gap commercial that seemed like I was really a professional DJ but I was just really dancing the whole time. It was just a little hobby.
SG: Whether you were fully invested or not, you worked pretty steadily for 10 years. Were you able to pay your rent from acting?
SS: Yeah, I have been able to do that.
SG: What got your through the rough or lean times?
SS: Oh, unemployment. Family, friends. There have been some incredibly lean times. This last pregnancy was really hard. I didnt work for two years and I couldnt afford to not work for two years but I knew I was supposed to have another child and when it happens, it happens. Just faith and hope. Its such a cliche I feel like at this point, but there have been many times where I thought I should just quit. So when I hear the actors that I admire and love, like Marion Cotillard and Amy Adams and Naomi Watts and Marisa Tomei, these women whose integrity and personal drive I admire and also actresses that have success in later years, thats the only option for me now. Im 34. You just have to have some kind of faith, but what I was going to say is its nice to hear from all of them that there were these periods where they felt like quitting and I understand what that feels like. Now I understand what that feels like.
SG: Now that youre back, does it feel like a whole different world for actors?
SS: It does. It is strange. What do you make of it?
SG: I think there are so many new opportunities for movies to be on VOD or download, and theres more TV shows like you were on series for FX and HBO which is a new thing in the last 10 years. There are so many more avenues, but I wonder does that mean there are more opportunities or its more competitive?
SS: Oh, good, good, good, good question/thoughts. I love analyzing this stuff. I love studying the business very much, even from my house. Its fascinating to me. I think a couple things. I think it does make it more competitive, but I do feel that actors do themselves a disservice to be too competitive, and Ive felt this for a while. Ive noticed in just observing that theres this intensely intense competitive quality that actors possess for survival reasons alone that is admirable in one way because its like wow, you really have access to this hunger, but I believe that the energy is channeled into the wrong department and it rips them of the magic, the childlike magic that is required for truly great work. Their bodies are hardbodies, theyre charming as shit at every moment. Its so disturbing almost to watch. So I dont know if that competitiveness is really a danger for actors, and this will lead me to my next thing which is that Ive also noticed were in a time right now where the cream will rise to the top and that should give actors who are meant to be sharing and telling stories, its very lucky for them. As you said, there are so many avenues and ways to be seen that if youre doing it from the right place and youre doing truly good intentioned quality work, youre going to be okay because it will rise to the top and you couldnt go by unnoticed where you might have years ago.
SG: I agree with that. If youre good it spreads. Even people being discovered on YouTube.
SS: Yeah, I was going to say especially that. I think a lot of comedians are realizing that that might be their ticket. They dont have to wait to get on SNL. They can actually make their own skits and put them online. Thats the blessing of the time right now, that if youre good, then show us what youve got because everyones watching.
SG: You have a role coming up on Mistresses. How is that the next step for you?
SS: That was an interesting step. My manager really pushed me into that and Im grateful that he did because it was a good move. I had just had my second son. Id gained a lot of weight. I was in a very soft, nursing, couch kind of place. It was about four months after Id had him and he said, Its just seven episodes, in and out. You dont have to sign a six year contract. Its a soft role so it really matched with my state of being at that time, really soft. Shes a kind of passive half of a lesbian relationship. I really loved the costar I was working with, the person I had to be in a relationship with, Jes Macallan. Shes a wonderful actress and I just had a lot of fun, and it financially supported me because I hadnt worked for a year and a half, so there were more reasons than just the financial.